With a little more than a handful of Piston games left this season, Danny and I take a look at the last few games and what’s left in store this season.
There are positives and negatives, but as week look forward and back. What will this team look like next season? Will the team be sold soon? What is the roster going to look like? Will Tayshaun Prince give the Pistons a home team discount next season? What’s with the upcoming draft? Where does Austin Daye fit in? Is Rodney Stuckey the face of this franchise? Will Rip be next season player/coach?
We cover a lot.
And Danny once again make a bold prediction! Listen in, and feel free to mock.
New Need4Sheed.com Detroit Pistons Podcast
What’s left and what will be
[audio:https://need4sheed.com/audio/need4sheed_podcast_march_21_2011.mp3]
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lot of hate for stuckey you see him as a poor man’s mike conley i see mike conley as the rich man’s chuky atkins, stuckey is more like jamal crawford in an nba that doesnt value combo guards, you want either pure shooting guards, pass first pure point guards, or superstars that are so good it doesnt matter if you play combo-forwards and combo-points (wade lebron).
stuckey will never have a great jump shot, but he is very good defender, and if there’s anything this pistons team needs, that is defense.
Really would like to keep stuckey especially if we sign him for the same contract that conley has, but . . . we got ben gordon, rip still on the books, I can’t blame stuckey if he wants to leave.
We’ll have a team next year rip, prince (resigned), ben gordon, Charlie V, Maxiell, bynum, greg monroe, Austin Daye, jerebko and our draft picks
stuckey will be gone, wallace will retire, t-mac will leave for a nice offer, and the team will still not be sold.
and Ben Gordon will be our new point guard, woo hoo.
Pistons 2012 lineup:
PG : Ben Gordon
SG: Rip Hamilton
SF: Tayshaun Prince
PF: Jonas Jerebko
PF: Greg Monroe
Jamal Crawford is a shooting guard. He’s been a starting shooting guard for the Knicks (with Marbury), Bulls (with Hinrich, before they drafted Gordon) and now Atlanta (with Bibby, Teague, Hinrich, and even Joe Johnson). At this point, I’d take 4 seasons of Jamal Crawford over Stuckey. At least Crawford can spread the floor with his 3 point shooting ability.
I’d take Conley and his 14ppg, near 7 assists, 45% fg, and 38% from 3 over Stuckey if it meant paying Conley his contract over paying Stuckey the same as Conley. Calling Conley a “rich man’s” Chucky Atkins is simply ludicrous. Conley is a far better defensive point guard than a lot of people give him credit for, not to mention the offensive efficiency.
I think listing out a pathetic starting lineup doesn’t make for a good argument to re-sign Stuckey. Just because the team will appear to be awful without Stuckey doesn’t mean bringing back the same sad 30 win bunch is the answer either. If/when the team loses Stuckey, Prince, Wilcox and if Wallace retires they will be forced to make deals to fill the roster.
No one “hates” Stuckey. We don’t “hate” Stuckey. He’s been on the team 4 seasons. Cut bait, instead of overpaying him.
Why would Tayshaun come back?
prince wants to stay in detroit that’s all I ever heard, that’s all he has said this past year, and all the rumors i have heard say he wants to resign, that he absolutely does not want to leave detroit. Remember how Rip foiled that deal that would have sent him to cleveland who would have bought him out, it’s not just about money about him getting all the money, Rip wanted to stay here in Detroit. Prince wants to stay too, remember, Q for sure will be gone next year and Rip will still be here, and Prince will be too, he wants to be here even if he has to take a pay cut.
I mean if you or me were in Prince’s shoes, and someone offered us a few extra million to play for Cleveland or Boston we would do it, but Prince wants to stay here, and I don’t think an extra million or two makes any difference to him.
I didnt mean you hate stuckey, he’s seems to be a nice young man, I meant you were “hating on” him, that is you were more concerned with pointing out his negatives instead of his positives.
I think if there is any “face” to this pistons team it is Rip Hamilton. He sort of represents what it means to be a Detroit Pistons player. Impossible to coach, not as good as he thinks he is, and not leaving any time soon.
I would be surprised if Tay stays, he actually said this season that he wanted to play for a contender right before the trade deadline. You never know what’s gong to happen.
Can Rip really be the face of the franchise after this season?
tay said it was intriguing, but he has also said he wants to stay in detroit. obviously what is key for prince is for coach q to be gone, and a lot of prince saying he wants to be gone is his frustration with q and how q treated his buddy rip. Once these final games are over and it is clear that Q gets fired and Rip isnt moved, Prince will try his best to say with detroit.
All this depends of course on the team not being sold (how on earth can you sell a team so close to a new cba?), with no new owner, and joe dumars unable to make any moves that cost money.
stuckey is our best small player, who else would be? i say we keep him and build around him, monroe daye and jj throw in bg and terrrico? then we can run n gun like stuckey is always saying he wants to do. try it his way for a year or two if its not working oh well we still arent going to be any good in two years anyway. edt i love the rip being the face of the team comment, its true.
is anyone else here going to the game to watch rodmans jersey get retired? i am. ill be sitting right where the players walk in and out of the locker room. ill b there with my STUCKEY jersey on, hopefully i can get it signed.
you probably wont, I have gone to many pistons games at the Palace and they dont really sign for anyone outside of a 2 feet reach. The only time I ever got a autograph was when I had passes to be down by the locker room in Orlando. Then I got all but rip and t-mac’s.
i will be right at the tunnel, i hope u r wrong
I listened to the pod cast and there were some good points…I believe most of today’s NBA players are looked at on potential. Look at Rodney Stucky for instance. Everyone want’s results right away..they are looking at the moment in which Rodney is playing now. He’s been in the league for 4 years and he is all but 24 years old. He has at least 10 more NBA years and people are making decisions based on what he is doing now. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing but it’s a true thing.
Look at General management. What they see is a person who may (one day) should be able to dominate at his position if he ever turns the corner. That is why they are “forcing” Stucky on the Fans…because they are looking at his potential and what he may becomes..so it’s rolling the dice and their hoping to lucky…because Rodney at 24 years old does still have a ton of potential.
Most people focus on Rodney’s offence, how many assist he have per game, how many points he scores, how he doesn’t set up his teammates..that’s all cool and it’s good to talk about…but hardly anyone ever talks about his defense. They talk about the defeat against NY but I haven’t heard anyone talk about how Stucky was instrumental in shutting down C. Anthony. He guards everyone from Chris Paul to Kobe Bryant. At this point in his Career his Defense is Greater then his offence and that’s the reason I thing why management thinks so highly of Stucky…put some good defenses around Stucky and you can have a very good defensive team. That’s my opinion.
i did say he did great on anthony.
please exuse the grammer and spelling. I’m on break and had to rush..haha
Great podcast.
Nat, i share your view on stuckey all the way.
I think the new owner may ‘blow up’ the team.
i like Joe D. I hope he remains.
The point guard position is always gonna be a tough figure for Detroit. Even if Stuckey isn’t exactly pure point guard material, he’s still going to be the starter for Detroit because A.) there might be no “pure” point guards on this team, let alone one you would want to start and B.) Point Guard wise, the 2011-2012 free agency list is short on talent, unless you want JJ Barea or Earl Watson starting (if they even choose to not resign with their teams).
Best hope there is if you REALLY don’t want Stuckey starting at PG is to draft one. Doubt they’ll get Kemba, but depending on draft position they could get Nolan Smith, Kyrie Irving, Brandon Knight, hell, even Jimmer, (even though I think he’s gonna be the next JJ Redick).
I don’t think Stuckey is going to suddenly be Dwayne Wade tomorrow and carry a team on his back to the finals (and remember Wade had Shaq). Having said that I think he is an above average player who can be a starter (at either guard position) on a contender. But if Stuckey’s assists are ever going to go up, he’s going to have to have players who can catch the damn ball, something Stuckey in four years really has not enjoyed (until Monroe started at the mid point of this season). But I think the issue is also Stuckey was never meant to be the guy you build the team around. People make that assumption because Stuckey replaced Chauncey Billups. But clearly Hamilton and Prince were supposed to be the guys you build the team around. OK maybe Prince and Gordon under the assumption that Hamilton was supposed to be traded to make room for Gordon. The point is that the whole plan got derailed because of the injuries last year. But frankly, I’d rather have Stuckey starting with kids than the mystery meat we’re having to watch now. At least the ball would move around a bit.
We have to remember that this is really the 1rst year this team has played together, and it takes more than one year to build chemistry. It also takes a coach that can get the most out of his team. The style best suited for this team is uptempo with constant ball movement. Assists should come from every position, because we can score from every position. Stuckey isn’t a pure point, but he has shown in many games that he can be a capable one. With a consistent line up I feel Stuckey would easily hit or eclipse the numbers mentioned for Conley. Even if Joe did send Stuck packing It would be a sign and trade for value in return but I don’t think Joe just let’s him walk. The Focus should be on gaining a tough shot blocking rebounding big to compliment Monroe, and Prince if he stays or Jerebko if he don’t. The Focus should also be on gaining a new Coach, maybe it’s time to give Laimbeer a shot? Hopefully the sale of this team will be completed before the start of next season, so we can get an owner that actually cares about basketball. This team doesn’t need a major overhaul like many people think, just a thinning of the guard jam (I think Mcgrady will leave but we gotta figure a way to dump either Rip or B.G.), another key addition to the paint, and a coach the team will respect.
Oh and to answer Nat’s question; No Rip cannot be the face of the Pistons or any other team after this year. The sooner he accepts that the sooner he can move on, and just play ball. Hopefully for another team though.
i really like rip hamilton as a player, i love the way he has an incredible catch and release and of our bung up at the shooting guard position he is one of the few that has above average defense, as others have said his is a finesse game so he should have another 5 years of elite level play in him, also because of the way he plays, he doesn’t really suffer the terrible injuries hi fliers do he doesn’t get horrible ankle injuries due to impact landings because kevin garnett slides underneath you on a dunk.
But rip has a TERRIBLE attitude problem. he refuses to play at his elite level of he comes off the bench, you put him on the bench, he sulks he throws tantrums, he throws the ball half ass at the rim, he refuses to admit that he has lost a step and frankly he hasnt lost much.
This is why I really want rip to go, it’s all attitude. Ben Gordon by contrast has always had a good attitude coming off the bench but he gets into these horrible shooting ruts where he’ll hold onto the ball for about 1/4 of a second longer than he has to, until his shooting window closes, he just looks at the rim as if to say “I can’t do it, I cant shoot the ball anymore!” a horrible mental block. rip by contrast is able to klang it up 20 times in a row and his release is just as quick the 20th time as the first time.
Ben gordon thinks too much. Why do you think he was so much better as a younger player that’s because 2 or 3 years ago he didnt think he was unconscious now he spends all his time thinking about it, and if you think about it, instead of do, you are just too slow too aware, you hvae to be unconscious.
I dont want either of them on this team. Prince is showing a lot of miles, he cant be putting in 35 minutes a game, he went to the playoffs so many times against a lot of bigger more physical defenders, I keep thinking one of these games his back will give out. I dont want prince.
Austin Daye has no been able to defend, unfortuantely. he is one of the best shooters in the NBA, but can’t defend. I dont want him.
Tmac is no way to build a team, he has to go to a contender, I dont want him.
I got reasons for every player, dont get me wrong, some of them I like, but I just dont think any of them belong as a piston.
Monroe, Stuckey, Jerebko.
I would love to trade for the equivalent of a chaunchey billips and whoever our draft pick is. We do need veterans to help our young team but the vets we have just dont have the right attitude they have mental blocks, cant play defense, or cant see the entire court properly.
It has to be completely torn down, throw everything out except for monroe stuckey & jerebko.
I see what you’re saying EDT and I have to agree with almost everything. I would still like to give Austin a go..he may just get that whole defense thing…but you’re right he’s a liability right now along with the rest our this team on the defensive end.
austin was giving starting minutes at the beginning of the year, didnt develop defense, put on the bench, didnt develop defense, was given a whole year from his rookie year didnt develop defense.
by contrast, monroe gets better every game.
I’m not giving up on Austin Daye, he’s just not going to develop next year, or the year after that he’ll be ready sometime in 2013-2014, at which point, he will be a free agent and leave or cost too much to keep him, or he will have been a failure, and have zero trade value.
None of these options are appealing to me.
If Daye just developed faster . . . if Daye just showed a little bit of defensive improvement from 2009 if you look at his minutes his usage is 13 minutes 2009-2010, 20 minutes 2010-2011, then I suspect he’ll continue like this, get a bit better endurance, 2011-2012, 27 minutes, 2013-2014, he’ll finally grow into a player that can start at the NBA.
Look we all remember Tayshuan Prince, 2004 as a sophmore same age as Austin Daye is now, when he pursued Reggie Miller swatted the ball so that rip got it, with a stunning victory over the pacers . . .
And in 2003 Prince had an incredible performance against the 6ers in the 7th game scoring 20 points in 24 minutes.
Daye is never gonna develop into a Prince-like player, he’ll never have Prince’s athleticism. Daye has feet suck in the mud, he defends from the side, he can’t sprint down the court, he has inferior jumping ability, what he has is the body which is too slow for a guard or small forward position but it could grow into a power forward with a shooting guard’s stroke, if he is able to put on about 80 pounds between now and october.
I mean the reason I give so much more slack to stuckey is that physically he is an imposing specimen. Daye has length and can shoot. That’s it. Can’t defend, can’t post up, can’t run the court, has struggled with endurance, is not an elite passer or ball handler.
You look at Austin Daye and think, “Can’t teach height.”
I think he’ll eventually grow into a pretty good NBA player but he’ll do this when he’s 29 years old. The way the NBA is built, it doesn’t pay to groom long term prospects, you need them to develop right away, because if it takes too long, as soon as they get good they’ll leave.
If he were a superstar or had potential to be a super star that would be different, we could hold on to him, the new CBA will let teams keep one “lebron” on their team, but he’s never going to reach that super star heights, he is just not developing fast like superstars do.
I think given the chemistry problems on this team that some sort of housekeeping is in order. With Gordon, however, I still maintain there are extenuating circumstances. People forget he had off season ankle surgery last year. For a jump shooter, ankles and feet are so key. I’d like to see what Gordon could do on a team without having to play behind Hamilton and with a full off season to get in shape without surgery and rehabbing before I make a final judgment. Further, if the Pistons are ever going to see value for him, it’s going to have to come with the Pistons first, his trade value has got to be below even Hamilton’s at this point. I agree with edt that the Pistons problems are that they are soft, physically and mentally, so I understand where he’s coming from. But I think, based on the background I’ve outlined, that there is some hope that some other players on this team can step up and help fix those things internally and that Gordon and Daye might also be part of the solution.
There will be some good players available in draft for detroit.
Alec Burks, watch him in the NIT, he can play the point and is amazing.
Please God no, no more guards. To paraphrase WIlly S. — For the want of a center … etc.